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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 12:31:30 AM
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dbmurray
Posts: 419
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From: NC
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It all boils down to who the opening acts and headliners are. I've seen opening acts at concerts that had no business being on a ticketed event of any sort...and a few headliners as well. On the other hand, I've had the joy of seeing some terrific artists open for the very first time.
The promoter's responsibility is to make sure the opening acts are ready before putting them on the platform.
I took the poll question differently, though. "When you pay for a concert ticket to see a major artist, do you mind sitting through two or three local groups before the featured singers appear?"
Key phrases: "when you pay" and "two or three"
I don't mind sitting through one local act if they're limited to less than thirty minutes or so. If forty five minutes pass and the third local act is just taking the stage, they weren't advertised, and I paid to see a group like Gold City, then yes, I'm starting to get a bit irritated even if the local acts are decent.
There's a concert series in our area that typically has one local act sing two songs to kick off the evening. It's usually a soloist, but sometimes it's a choir or a group. The first advertised group will then sing 20-30 minutes. Sometimes this group is a local, well-established name (like my quartet which is in its 15th year), and sometimes it's a national up and coming group. Last month, for example, the Crist Family opened for Triumphant Quartet.
That's a good balance. Everyone who buys a ticket knows they are going to see two groups. They also get ten minutes of a singer or group they didn't know about in advance. Often, it's a pleasant addition, but even on the rare occasion when it's painful, it's just two songs.
On the other hand, I've been to some concerts where the headliner was the only group advertised, but after paying, you have to sit through an hour of local groups that can't sing their way out of a wet paper bag.
< Message edited by dbmurray -- 2/8/2008 12:37:31 AM >
_____________________________
David Bruce Murray
http://www.musicscribe.com
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 12:47:07 AM
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bigboytenor
Posts: 581
Joined: 4/17/2007
From: Webb City, MO
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As a former member of a "local" group, let me say that I agree with a lot of what has been posted here. I wouldn't want to sit through 2 - 3 groups. One, OK, but no more if it hasn't been advertised.
There certainly are good local groups out there. In fact, my old group opened for the Bishops and Isaacs (obviously more than a few years ago) and we were allowed 20 minutes that was actually prior to the start time for the concert. As we came off stage the promoter/emcee turned to Lily Isaacs and said, "Hmmm, I didn't know the local talent was supposed to be as good as the national." Her response was, "You're not kidding. Those boys can sing." She's a gracious lady.
Anyway, if they're good I can handle 20 - 30 minutes. Then move on to those people came to see. Because as has been mentioned, I've been to enough concerts with local groups who couldn't hit a pitch swinging a 4'X8' sheet of plywood. They sang their 45 minutes while the crowd basically ignored them.
BTW, any time we opened for a national group, it was merely for the exposure. We never expected any monetary compensation. We got a ton of bookings from those events and sold quite a bit of product as well.
_____________________________
Jesus said that in the last days there would be earthquakes, pestilence, distress of nations, famine, signs in the sky, wars and rumors of wars. Sound familiar? Are you ready?
Daryl
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 12:50:18 AM
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Billboy
Posts: 1261
Joined: 3/26/2006
From: S. Illinois
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I do not mind a local group, singing a limited set. In our area, some of the concerts are sponsored by local groups. If they are bringing in the headliner, they certainly have the right to open for them. When I was in a group we only opened for one big-name group. We did 3 songs the first time, and 2 the second half. It was a great experience for us and the major group was very friendly and helpful to us. I, too, would not want to sit through an hour of opening acts if I was there to see a big-name group. There is one big 2-night concert in our area which is practically all local and regional groups, and it is always a joy to attend.
_____________________________
I'm a God-fearing, hard working, So. Gospel music loving, Cub watching, tractor driving, International Harvester man.
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 3:57:52 AM
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pittsgirl
Posts: 90
Joined: 3/19/2007
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I voted that I do mind because I usually travel several hours to the concert specifically to see a certain group. If other groups are on the billing, then I can choose whether or not I want to buy a ticket and go to see them all. What I don't like is to be surprised by 2 or 3 groups that I wasn't expecting and sit for an hour or more before the group I paid to see is brought on stage. I have nothing against "local groups", I have been part of one in the distant past. I just don't think they need to stay on stage as long or longer than the advertised group.
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 5:11:57 AM
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GVfan
Posts: 14764
Joined: 3/28/2006
From: The Peach State
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I'm like many of you. I really don't mind sitting through ONE local group (no more than 20 mins.) if I knew it in advance. Then, I want to hear the group or groups I paid to see. And I absolutely agree that it's the promoter's responsibility to KNOW that the local group is good before putting them in front of a "payng" audience. If there are multiple groups, I feel that an "opening" group is not necesary.
Hearing the local group gives me a chance to determine whether I'd like to hear more from them, and even if I want to buy some of their CDs. I like that these groups are given the opportunity to get in front of paying SG fans and I like that I am given the opportunity to encourage them. On the other hand, I have sat through more than a few opening sets that were absolutely painful!
_____________________________
Donna Hefner
Acworth, Ga.
<<------ Jason Waldroup...with Greater Vision for just a little less than 2 weeks.
Come visit me at http://www.myspace.com/donnashappenings
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 7:23:08 AM
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Seaton
Posts: 1347
Joined: 5/12/2006
From: Mooresville, NC
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I really can't handle more than one 'local' group per concert. A strong 'local' group with no more than 20-25 minutes is fine. I actually passed up going to a free concert last Saturday night to see Jeff & Sheri Easter and Gordon Mote because the radio advertisement announced more than a half dozen 'local' artists that were going to sing.
I thought to myself, it will be midnight by the time Jeff & Sheri and Gordon Mote take the stage. I passed.
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 8:46:37 AM
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rkr27504
Posts: 38
Joined: 3/24/2006
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I have sung professionally...however, I sing with my daughter and have been for the last 10 years.....we appreciate ALL the people who give us the chance to sing on larger venues with "major" artists. Thanks to people like MsJudy and TQ_Fan who still support people like us!
Keith
www.myspace.com/rivenbarkfamilyministries
_____________________________
"Always say what you mean. Because those who mind, don't matter and those who matter, won't mind."
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 10:01:56 AM
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pamr40
Posts: 63
Joined: 5/10/2006
From: Dallas Area, Texas
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I actually do agree that too many artists (whether they are new, local or major) makes for a night that's just too long. I also have heard some folks who, while they enjoy music shouldn't necessarily try to sing it.
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New Day
www.newdayministriesonline.com
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 10:19:18 AM
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robertyork
Posts: 6900
Joined: 3/23/2006
From: Marietta, GA
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Being a promoter at first I thought I'd pass this thread and say nothing, but I think I'll add my 2 cents worth. I support local groups, if it wasn't for local groups getting a start we would never have a major group. I remember when EHSS got started, if it hadn't been for promoters giving this group a start they may not be where they are today. I can go on with other groups.
I only use one local group and most of the time one major group. I usually give the local group 30-35 minutes to start, then the major group. Most of the time only the major group returns the second half. One problem I have with some of the major groups they don't want to sing over 45 minutes the first half and two or three songs the second half, no matter how much time you schedule them for. I like to have about a 2 1/2 to 3 hour concert.
When I use local groups, I know the group, have seen the group in person and listened to their cds. I don't just take any group to open. A lot of the local groups I use have their own following and bring people to the concert that wouldn't otherwise attend. You would be surprised at the number of people that just come because their favorite local group is singing.
edit: I advertise the local group that is singing with the major group also so that people attending will know that there is a local group opening and who that group will be.
< Message edited by robertyork -- 2/8/2008 10:29:12 AM >
_____________________________
KING'S HERALDS featuring Jeff Pearles
& ENLISTED COMING TO ACWORTH, GA - AUG 16
[link] www.theheralds.org
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 10:20:44 AM
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DeeAnnBailey
Posts: 2128
Joined: 3/23/2006
From: SC
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rkr27504
I have sung professionally...however, I sing with my daughter and have been for the last 10 years.....we appreciate ALL the people who give us the chance to sing on larger venues with "major" artists. Thanks to people like MsJudy and TQ_Fan who still support people like us!
Keith
www.myspace.com/rivenbarkfamilyministries
I don't think anyone is saying they don't want to ever see local groups or that they don't support them. They just don't want to see so many before the group they paid for.
I go to concerts at times that are JUST local groups but I know that's what I'm getting when I go.
_____________________________
D. Ann Bailey
He's planned a beautiful design, but it will take some fire and time, But it's gonna be okay, 'Cause the Potter knows the clay'.
<<<Tim Riley, Alicia & Erin
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 10:27:58 AM
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MsJudy
Posts: 529
Joined: 3/7/2006
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That's the way I always did it Bobby. I applaud you! You're one fine promoter!!!
quote:
ORIGINAL: robertyork
Being a promoter at first I thought I'd pass this thread and say nothing, but I think I'll add my 2 cents worth. I support local groups, if it wasn't for local groups getting a start we would never have a major group. I remember when EHSS got started, if it hadn't been for promoters giving this group a start they may not be where they are today. I can go on with other groups.
I only use one local group and most of the time one major group. I usually give the local group 30-35 minutes to start, then the major group. Most of the time only the major group returns the second half. One problem I have with some of the major groups they don't want to sing over 45 minutes the first half and two or three songs the second half, no matter how much time you schedule them for. I like to have about a 2 1/2 to 3 hour concert.
When I use local groups, I know the group, have seen the group in person and listened to their cds. I don't just take any group to open. A lot of the local groups I use have their own following and bring people to the concert that wouldn't otherwise attend. You would be surprised at the number of people that just come because their favorite local group is singing.
edit: I advertise the local group that is singing with the major group also so that people attending will know that there is a local group opening and who that group will be.
_____________________________
~MsJudy~
MsJudy's Message Board
Brannin Agency
Christian Voice Magazine
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 10:51:08 AM
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Pianonut
Posts: 34
Joined: 1/18/2008
From: Central Alabama
Status: offline
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I can tell you this much, being in a "local" group myself, it's VERY discouraging to know that you're up there singing and playing your heart out and, as I hope and pray all groups are, doing this to further God's word through a music ministry, and you realize that people can't wait until you get done so they can hear the "major" artist! As some of you have said, everyone has to start out somewhere. If the "minor" artists listened or read some of the negative remarks, they would give up. The gentleman that started the group I'm in started the group in 1977 and he's 76 years old and can still sing with the BEST of them! Thank the Lord for his faithfullness and stewardship. But one of my greatest admirations for him is that he's never really cared about being recognized! He's in it for all of the right reasons. This could kind of be connected to the "Keep "Em On The Bus" thread because the local folks need support to. And thank you to all of you that do, it means so very much to us!
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 11:25:45 AM
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Brandon_and_Lisa
Posts: 82
Joined: 1/29/2007
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I'm ok with ONE local group opening for the concert headliners at ticketed events, but with certain conditions. (1) Announce that the local group will be there before the event. (2) Limit the local group's performance. Limit their time. Limit their talking. Limit their song choices. (3) Make sure the local group should be singing in public before you book them.
_____________________________
Coomer Cove
http://coomercove.wordpress.com
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 11:47:29 AM
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GVfan
Posts: 14764
Joined: 3/28/2006
From: The Peach State
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: robertyork
Being a promoter at first I thought I'd pass this thread and say nothing, but I think I'll add my 2 cents worth. I support local groups, if it wasn't for local groups getting a start we would never have a major group. I remember when EHSS got started, if it hadn't been for promoters giving this group a start they may not be where they are today. I can go on with other groups.
I only use one local group and most of the time one major group. I usually give the local group 30-35 minutes to start, then the major group. Most of the time only the major group returns the second half. One problem I have with some of the major groups they don't want to sing over 45 minutes the first half and two or three songs the second half, no matter how much time you schedule them for. I like to have about a 2 1/2 to 3 hour concert.
When I use local groups, I know the group, have seen the group in person and listened to their cds. I don't just take any group to open. A lot of the local groups I use have their own following and bring people to the concert that wouldn't otherwise attend. You would be surprised at the number of people that just come because their favorite local group is singing.
edit: I advertise the local group that is singing with the major group also so that people attending will know that there is a local group opening and who that group will be.
Yep! Bobby does it the right way!!!!
_____________________________
Donna Hefner
Acworth, Ga.
<<------ Jason Waldroup...with Greater Vision for just a little less than 2 weeks.
Come visit me at http://www.myspace.com/donnashappenings
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 12:19:48 PM
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TQ_Fan_4_Life
Posts: 3824
Joined: 5/8/2007
From: Fort Rucker
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Brandon_and_Lisa
I'm ok with ONE local group opening for the concert headliners at ticketed events, but with certain conditions. (1) Announce that the local group will be there before the event. (2) Limit the local group's performance. Limit their time. Limit their talking. Limit their song choices. (3) Make sure the local group should be singing in public before you book them.
I agree and don't agree with you because of these points.
#1. I agree. because as was said, I will go to see an artist perform because of the local group. case in point. I went to see The Kingdom Heirs instaed of Palmetto State because The Rider's opened for the Kingdom Heirs.
#2. I don't agree. You are therefore saying that they should not give a testimony over the way a song touched them, blessed them, or was a reason they came to know the Lord. or if you are they better give a paraphrased version. song choices, I do agree that if the local group covers a song that the "major" group does it may be a conflict of interest. what if the local group outperfroms the national group on it. I guess that might cause some heartache among the more famous ones.
#3. yes the group if just one should be somewhat known. but a question, how do the groups become even somewhat known? they all even the mighty groups of today and yesterday started somewhere. even if just for one or two songs, I say let even totally unknown groups in their first ever performance sing.
I guess it all boils down to saying this. and this isn't to you Brandon or anyone else.
I am unsure where God is calling me either to the spoken ministry or singing ministry. I have prayed and fasted a while now on this and I can just feel the calling. I am still struggling as to how He wants me to go. but the words have read from some on here, I have a good idea if I want to even be heard God needs to direct me to the Preaching ministry because I or even a group I start will be never heard.
Joey
_____________________________
Let go of a sanitized Christianity and get back to the powerful, raw and ancient faith that chooses revolution over compromise, peril over safety, and passion over lukewarm and watered-down religion.
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 12:32:52 PM
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Seaton
Posts: 1347
Joined: 5/12/2006
From: Mooresville, NC
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TQ_Fan_4_Life
I am unsure where God is calling me either to the spoken ministry or singing ministry. I have prayed and fasted a while now on this and I can just feel the calling. I am still struggling as to how He wants me to go. but the words have read from some on here, I have a good idea if I want to even be heard God needs to direct me to the Preaching ministry because I or even a group I start will be never heard.
Joey
Not at all. If you have the vocal talent to perform then do it. A few things I look for when watching new/up and coming artists.
*Can the performers sing? This is the most important.
*What is the new artist doing that separates them from everyone else. Country music has had problems with identity because they have so many 'carbon copy' artists.
*This goes hand in hand with the prior statement. Don't try to be someone else. Even if, as a regional artist, you are doing 'cover' songs make them your own. Don't give the audience a 'carbon copy' of the 'major' aritst's rendition.
*Provide a well balanced stage program that mixes ministry with entertainment.
If a new artist can accomplish this (for me) then I am inclined to not only purchase their music but am willing to go support them the next time they are in the area.
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 12:43:31 PM
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JimC
Posts: 1296
Joined: 6/17/2006
From: Kennesaw, GA
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: MsJudy
That's the way I always did it Bobby. I applaud you! You're one fine promoter!!!
quote:
ORIGINAL: robertyork
Being a promoter at first I thought I'd pass this thread and say nothing, but I think I'll add my 2 cents worth. I support local groups, if it wasn't for local groups getting a start we would never have a major group. I remember when EHSS got started, if it hadn't been for promoters giving this group a start they may not be where they are today. I can go on with other groups.
I only use one local group and most of the time one major group. I usually give the local group 30-35 minutes to start, then the major group. Most of the time only the major group returns the second half. One problem I have with some of the major groups they don't want to sing over 45 minutes the first half and two or three songs the second half, no matter how much time you schedule them for. I like to have about a 2 1/2 to 3 hour concert.
When I use local groups, I know the group, have seen the group in person and listened to their cds. I don't just take any group to open. A lot of the local groups I use have their own following and bring people to the concert that wouldn't otherwise attend. You would be surprised at the number of people that just come because their favorite local group is singing.
edit: I advertise the local group that is singing with the major group also so that people attending will know that there is a local group opening and who that group will be.
AMEN, Judy! He's the BEST!!
_____________________________
All gave some.....some gave ALL.
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 1:52:36 PM
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Brandon_and_Lisa
Posts: 82
Joined: 1/29/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TQ_Fan_4_Life
#2. I don't agree. You are therefore saying that they should not give a testimony over the way a song touched them, blessed them, or was a reason they came to know the Lord. or if you are they better give a paraphrased version.
I said limit... no eliminate. Testimony's should be given. By limit, I mean they should not talk five minutes before every three minute song. I don't want to hear a story before the second song, and the same story before the fifth song. I don't want to hear someone talk for 20 minutes during a 30 minute set.
quote:
#3. yes the group if just one should be somewhat known. but a question, how do the groups become even somewhat known? they all even the mighty groups of today and yesterday started somewhere. even if just for one or two songs, I say let even totally unknown groups in their first ever performance sing.
Are you saying every group starting out should get to open for a top group? Groups get known in their area by singing in local churches, not by opening for Gold City or another top group at an event people pay to attend. Letting "even totally unknown groups in their first ever performance sing" at ticketed events with major groups is not in the best interest of the group, the audience, the headliners, or the southern gospel genre itself.
I'm sorry for using this example, but I think of it as like minor league baseball. You start out in the minors and work your way up. Singing in your church is A ball. Singing in other local churches is AA ball. Singing in a wider area is AAA ball. Full-time groups are the majors. I would call being ready to open for paid concerts with top level groups as being "September Call-ups." These minor league call ups pull from the AAA level and exceptional talents at the AA level.
_____________________________
Coomer Cove
http://coomercove.wordpress.com
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 2:01:40 PM
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bigboytenor
Posts: 581
Joined: 4/17/2007
From: Webb City, MO
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Brandon_and_Lisa
quote:
ORIGINAL: TQ_Fan_4_Life
#2. I don't agree. You are therefore saying that they should not give a testimony over the way a song touched them, blessed them, or was a reason they came to know the Lord. or if you are they better give a paraphrased version.
I said limit... no eliminate. Testimony's should be given. By limit, I mean they should not talk five minutes before every three minute song. I don't want to hear a story before the second song, and the same story before the fifth song. I don't want to hear someone talk for 20 minutes during a 30 minute set.
quote:
#3. yes the group if just one should be somewhat known. but a question, how do the groups become even somewhat known? they all even the mighty groups of today and yesterday started somewhere. even if just for one or two songs, I say let even totally unknown groups in their first ever performance sing.
Are you saying every group starting out should get to open for a top group? Groups get known in their area by singing in local churches, not by opening for Gold City or another top group at an event people pay to attend. Letting "even totally unknown groups in their first ever performance sing" at ticketed events with major groups is not in the best interest of the group, the audience, the headliners, or the southern gospel genre itself.
I'm sorry for using this example, but I think of it as like minor league baseball. You start out in the minors and work your way up. Singing in your church is A ball. Singing in other local churches is AA ball. Singing in a wider area is AAA ball. Full-time groups are the majors. I would call being ready to open for paid concerts with top level groups as being "September Call-ups." These minor league call ups pull from the AAA level and exceptional talents at the AA level.
The only thing I would take exception with is that often times the "local" group can be better than the "Major Aritst." Unfortunately, in the music world, both secular and Christian, the success of a group often has more to do with who you know than what you sound like.
_____________________________
Jesus said that in the last days there would be earthquakes, pestilence, distress of nations, famine, signs in the sky, wars and rumors of wars. Sound familiar? Are you ready?
Daryl
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 2:10:49 PM
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Jeff_from_Kentucky
Posts: 1669
Joined: 7/5/2006
From: Kentucky
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Brandon_and_Lisa
I'm sorry for using this example, but I think of it as like minor league baseball. You start out in the minors and work your way up. Singing in your church is A ball. Singing in other local churches is AA ball. Singing in a wider area is AAA ball. Full-time groups are the majors. I would call being ready to open for paid concerts with top level groups as being "September Call-ups." These minor league call ups pull from the AAA level and exceptional talents at the AA level.
I like the baseball analogy. It makes sense phrased in those terms.
_____________________________
<< Frank Seamans and my son Jeffrey - September, 2007
"For me to live is Christ and to die is gain." Philippians 1:21
Dispatchers tell cops where to go!
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 2:21:32 PM
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Seaton
Posts: 1347
Joined: 5/12/2006
From: Mooresville, NC
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bigboytenor
The only thing I would take exception with is that often times the "local" group can be better than the "Major Aritst." Unfortunately, in the music world, both secular and Christian, the success of a group often has more to do with who you know than what you sound like.
I hear this statement used often. I don't totally disagree with it but if this statement is true then it is not going to take long before more than just a regional audience is hearing/hearing about the group. If the 'local' group is vocally better, can put on a better program and capture an audience's attention, then again it won't be long before they start generating a 'national buzz'.
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 3:50:20 PM
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Brandon_and_Lisa
Posts: 82
Joined: 1/29/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bigboytenor
often times the "local" group can be better than the "Major Aritst."
I've seen/heard this statement a lot. I know there are a lot of local groups that are right there in terms of talent of making it, and only need exposure or a big break. However, I think the key word is "can be better," not are better. I'll go as far to say the statement, while thrown around so much as fact, is in reality, the exception rather than the rule.
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Coomer Cove
http://coomercove.wordpress.com
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RE: Major artist vs Local Group - 2/8/2008 4:21:38 PM
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DeeAnnBailey
Posts: 2128
Joined: 3/23/2006
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Seaton, I would have passed, too!
