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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/23/2008 12:37:08 PM
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CzarofSGMR
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For some reason, this is about the response I expected when I made my post. I didn't think there would be many on this board who would agree with me because it's like the old question "Are you still beating your wife?"
Daniel, thank you for understanding where I was coming from and being willing to offer your opinion.
That being said . . .
#1 Regardless of what some of you have implied, I am not unpatirotic. I just think there's a time and a place for everything.
#2 It's nice to know that Mike Allen is a former Marine. So it my son.
#3 We all know that the country is at war. I don't need to be reminded of it at a gospel concert. Some of you may. To each his own.
#4 Paul asked for my opinion and I gave it to him. If you don't want my opinion, don't ask for it. It may not be what you want to hear.
Carry on as you see fit, Prophets. Just don't be surprised if I react the same way I do when I hear "OWAS" for the umpteenth time.
John Crenshaw
< Message edited by CzarofSGMR -- 8/23/2008 7:10:35 PM >
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/23/2008 12:51:02 PM
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Smokymtnsanta
Posts: 13461
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quote:
#3 We all know that the country is at war. I don't need to be reminded of it at a gospel concert. Some of you may. To each his own.
So when you are at a gospel concert you do not want the artists to acknowledge our servicemen and women that may be in the audience and ask them to stand to honor them???? That is what I get out of your statement. I think it is a GREAT HONOR for the artists to do this for the ones that have helped and may be helping our country to be "the land of the FREE". God Bless them for doing so.
_____________________________
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/23/2008 2:15:50 PM
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CzarofSGMR
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Smokymtnsanta
quote:
#3 We all know that the country is at war. I don't need to be reminded of it at a gospel concert. Some of you may. To each his own.
So when you are at a gospel concert you do not want the artists to acknowledge our servicemen and women that may be in the audience and ask them to stand to honor them???? That is what I get out of your statement. I think it is a GREAT HONOR for the artists to do this for the ones that have helped and may be helping our country to be "the land of the FREE". God Bless them for doing so.
Again, this question is another of those "are you still beating your wife?" types of question.
No, I don't see that it's necessary to honor our military at every gospel concert. Obviously you do. Should we also do this at every church service? How about when we go to the movies? How about a community concert event?
Why not also honor the doctors in the audience who have saved lives? How about honoring the pastors? Teachers need honoring also. Why don't we acknowledge and honor them, too?
My point is that no matter where we gather, there will be people in the audience that deserve our honor.
Yes, Santa, I'm going overboard with my response, but it's to make a point that there is a time and a place for everything.
Again, you have your opinion and I have mine . . . and don't expect me to debate each point I have made on here.
Give my best to Mrs. Claus and the elves.
John
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/23/2008 5:45:18 PM
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danielmount
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When I go to a patriotic event, I am happy to hear patriotic songs.
When I go to a Gospel concert, I hope to hear the Gospel, all the way through.
< Message edited by danielmount -- 8/23/2008 5:52:19 PM >
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/24/2008 12:09:36 AM
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JDFan
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I might have to chime in with the Czar and Mount over here and agree...more or less. There truly is a time and a place for everything. In my opinion, a Patriotic tune is not really one of those kinds of songs that a group would want to perform on a frequent basis. Such a practice, whether intentional or not, can eventually appear to be mechanical.
Many times I've seen an audience stand during a patriotic song and then immediately sit down as soon as it is over with, if not earlier. To me, this isn't really what you would call heart-felt patriotism. There are times when a patriotic song fits well in a gospel concert, but here is where gaging an audience properly comes in.
If a Patriotic song appears to be an obligatory part of the program rather than a spontaneous moment that will remain forever indelible in my mind, then it's not really worth putting on the program. But if the timing is just right for it, it makes for a moment that will be memorable for a long time.
Case in point: I eventually became sick of the Florida Boys song, "Declaration of Dependence". Although it is not as "patriotic"-type of tune as others, it was still a song that became a routine part of every Florida Boys performance. In my opinion, it lost its spark after about the 4th or 5th time-in-a-row I heard it. If it had been saved for special occasion, then it would have knocked em dead every time.
Now I'm not specifically accusing Mr. Jackson or any of the Prophets of this by any means, but let's face it, many groups do this to get a standing ovation or to boost product sales. Sad as it may be, that's just the plain, blunt truth. Mr. Jackson stands on the platform that the Prophets are not doing such a thing, and I for one choose to believe him.
I consider myself a patriotic individual, but like it has been said, there is a time and a place.
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/24/2008 4:56:19 AM
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pauljackson
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Thank you JDfan for giving me the benefit of the doubt. Only God knows what is really in our spirit, until it is revealed by the words of our mouth. I too accept your assertion that you are a patriotic person. Thanks for your contribution to this little chat we are having.
The "time and place" theme keeps coming up.
I think, that is probably the real point of our disagreement.
Clearly we have varying views on what is the right "time and place" to express our patriotic sentiments.
John C, I do think it is fine to have a patriotic expression at any public or semi-public gathering...any "time and place"...IF you do not share that opinion (and clearly you do not), that's OK. I don't think that means you are not patriotic. I think it means that you have a different opinion than mine. As they say, this is America. You are entitled to your own opinion. I respect that. I would ask that you respect mine. I think you do.
I believe that we "older" adults...we singers, pastors, writers, teachers and leaders...Sunday school teachers...and yes, we Christians, have a little more responsibilty to preserve, by example and practice, the public displays of patriotic respect for those who serve us all. I think it should be our pre-determined policy to do so.
I certainly do not think that this trumps in any way our high calling to lift up The Cross and the mighty Gospel of Grace...and the blessed Name of Jesus. I have spent my life doing that. Will continue as long as God gives me breath.
So...I think it would not only be acceptable, but would be a good thing for our society, if their were more public expressions of USA patriotism. If we had a Movie theater in my town that decided they were going to play the National Anthem before every feature presentation, I would consider that acceptable, and even good. Might frequent that establishment more often.
A "community concert" was mentioned. Yes. I think that would be a perfect "time and place" to REMEMBER OUR TROOPS and their families. I don't know if that means that I am more patriotic than someone else. It does mean that I do love and welcome any appropriate, respectful public expression of our love of country. Anytime. Any place.
In the words of JDfan, "case in point": My son and I recently took my Dad to New York City to see the Yankees play in their fabled Yankee Stadium. It was my Dad's 80th birthday. We WENT to see 3 baseball games. All three nights, before the game began, the announcer, asked us to STAND (all 40,000 of us) and observe a moment of silence in honor of our Troops, both the living and the dead. Then, the announcer directed our attention to one of several US Flags present and asked us to join in the singing of our National Anthem. At the 7th inning stretch (about 2 hours later) before the traditional singing of "Take Me Out to the Ballgame", once again the PA announcer, asked all 40,000 of us to stand and sing GOD BLESS AMERICA. All of this took time, effort and planning. It was not something they do spontaneously...you know, IF they feel like it's the right "time and place"...NO it's something they do deliberately, with forethought and intent. Some may have thought it was all "cheezy" and a waste of time. After all, they had paid their money and had come to see a ball game...not to be reminded of Duty, Honor, Country.
I asked the usher how often they did all of this at their games. He replied that they had both a pregame and a 7th Inning observance at every game. ALL 82 Home games. Might become old hat to some. I suspect that it would bring tears to my eyes and a lump to my throat, like it did, if I was there for all 82 x 2= 164 moments of PDP.
Finally, I do find it a little sad that there seems to be a small element within in the SG world that reacts to our patriotic expressions with a little coolness...maybe even a little cynicism. As if we have intruded on their personal space. As in " you took up my time with something that I did not come to this concert to hear"... or "I don't really care for patriotic songs on a gospel Cd"...something like that.
SmokyMountainSanta said it perfectly when he asserted that it is our "duty" to show respect for the Flag, our soldiers, etc. Especially since 9-11. Especially with our troops in harms way. I agree. Thanks for listening.
PJ
< Message edited by pauljackson -- 8/24/2008 5:06:27 AM >
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/24/2008 7:12:02 AM
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danielmount
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From: Ohio
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quote:
ORIGINAL: pauljackson
The "time and place" theme keeps coming up.
I think, that is probably the real point of our disagreement.
Clearly we have varying views on what is the right "time and place" to express our patriotic sentiments.
Yes, I think you nailed it. None of us object to patriotic songs; all we're discussing is whether we want to hear them at Gospel concerts...or, perhaps more specifically, every time we hear a certain group perform.
quote:
Finally, I do find it a little sad that there seems to be a small element within in the SG world that reacts to our patriotic expressions with a little coolness...maybe even a little cynicism. As if we have intruded on their personal space. As in " you took up my time with something that I did not come to this concert to hear"... or "I don't really care for patriotic songs on a gospel Cd"...something like that.
As I mentioned, we don't mind patriotic songs if the occasion is right. Some of us would just rather hear Gospel songs throughout a Gospel concert.
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http://www.danielmount.com/
http://www.southerngospelblog.com/
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/24/2008 8:39:20 AM
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Qtman
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A concert is normally 1 to 1 and 1/2 hours long. A typical song is three minutes. That is a very small percentage of the concert. I would much rather hear a non-Gospel song than begging for money etc.
I know all of this is just opinion like everybody else. But IMHO there are two thing there is never a wrong place or time for. First and foremost, the Gospel. Followed closely by displays of Patriotism. Like I said in a post much earlier in this thread. I might feel differently if it was not so personal. I know to many of the boys whose name appears on that wall. I helped to bury many of them and held the hands of a few as they passed over.
I know I can get blunt when this subject comes up. Please understand it is not something personal between me and any poster here. It is just personal period.
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~rogasinger4Him
Body Piercings
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/24/2008 12:49:18 PM
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pauljackson
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SAM, YOU are a blessing friend. Thank you for your service to your country, your friends and your God.
We have all been served by YOUR sacrifices for us...all of us.
I am glad it is so "personal" with you. I agree that 3-5 minutes of a program is never too much for us to offer to those who have given large chunks of their lives. Even the NY Yankees say amen!
Some gave much. All gave some. Many gave All...
...and "Today we live in Freedom, BECAUSE THEY GAVE..."
_____________________________
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www.pauljacksongroup.com/blog
www.myspace.com/pauljacksonsings
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/24/2008 1:04:34 PM
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Smokymtnsanta
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Paul and Sam, I certainly appreciate your stand about what we are discussing here and appreciate your posts. I will look forward to standing anytime I hear a patriotic sung at any place I am at and look forward to seeing the artists ask for any former or present service men or women to stand so we can honor them. God Bless America.
_____________________________
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CHRISTmas time's a comin'
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/24/2008 3:11:07 PM
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Qtman
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What gets me Santa is after something happens all teh patriots come out of the wood works. After 9-11 the companies that manufacture the US Flags could not keep up with the demand. Unfortunately this only lasted a couple of months. The same companies can barely give those flags away now. But we have strayed way off topic.
Paul I love the Prophets and the Project and all the songs on it. And, I look forward to hearing them performed live.
_____________________________
Remember: God loves you and I'm trying!
~rogasinger4Him
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/25/2008 1:22:50 AM
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pauljackson
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Qtman
What gets me Santa is after something happens all the patriots come out of the wood works. After 9-11 the companies that manufacture the US Flags could not keep up with the demand. Unfortunately this only lasted a couple of months. The same companies can barely give those flags away now. But we have strayed way off topic.
Paul I love the Prophets and the Project and all the songs on it. And, I look forward to hearing them performed live.
Thanks Sam. I don't think you veered off topic. This is a thread about The Prophets...AND this is an issue of vital concern to The Prophets.
As I stated at the Fan Festival, one of the first decisions we made about our Cd, was that we wanted to include a patriotic song. We felt it appropriate at anytime...but especially appropriate during this time of War. It was an issue of influence...of leadership. We want to be a good and Godly influence on our audience, and we want to offer some leadership for God's people. This is not a group of upstarts. This group is made up of 5 men with sincere dedication to the Lord and 190 years of experience in Gospel Music and Ministry. All of us share a desire to make a difference in peoples lives...in the Church...in the Nation.
Now some will say, "if the music is not very good you won't have much of a ministry"....well it's a little naive to think that after 190 years of experience that this group doesn't already know that. Been knowing that. Gee Whiz, my volunteer choir knows that.
So....with an award winning group of producers and arrangers helping us, we worked hard to record a quality project that would be more than a nostalgia piece. It was our goal to honor the past but also lay a foundation for the future. Our Cd is not perfect but it is quality. Our stage presentation is not perfect, but it is quality with a purpose.
Ed Hill made it clear to me and to anybody that would listen, that he wanted this version of The Prophets to be more about ministry than the original group ever was. That is not a knock on the original group. The only member from that group that I know personally is Ed. I think the exact quote from Ed was, "the first time we were just about the music. This time we want to bless the people. We want it to be about the Lord."
Talk like that is music to my ears. My whole life has been about spreading the Gospel to the lost AND blessing the Believer!
I think using our small platform as a means to remind us all of our need to be grateful, is part of that ministry. WE are grateful to God first and foremost for spiritual freedom and the great privilege to be Americans, in this life. We are also very grateful to the men and the women who preserve our personal and national freedom, by putting their lives on the line everyday.
The virtue of GRATITUDE is one that must be cultivated through influence and leadership. There is never a "time or place" where GRATITUDE is not appropriate. A recent Gaither song summarized it all. "LOVING GOD, LOVING EACH OTHER"...that's The Prophets' mission. To do that AND to influence and lead others to do the same. And one of the ways we do that is by "Making music with our friends"...amen.
Thanks Sam, for believing in what we are trying to do.
_____________________________
Paul Jackson / The Prophets
www.pauljacksongroup.com
www.pauljacksongroup.com/blog
www.myspace.com/pauljacksonsings
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/25/2008 1:33:04 PM
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G.I.MOM
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When presented with the opportunity to pay honor to my friends and family who have defended your rights, and some who have paid the ultimate price, I can't think of a better place than a Southern Gospel Concert. Until now I had never met a person who would choose to complain about this tradition. Patriotic songs have been a part of Southern Gospel for as long as I can remember.
I am very proud of OUR servicemen and women. Above all I will stand for Jesus with pride.
But, honoring and encourageing and uplifting our fathers, mothers, brothers, sister, sons and daughters I am called to do. I will stand out of respect for them defending me!!
Jesus gave His life so we can live forever. The American G.I. so we can live in the USA.
God has been so very good to me. More than I deserve.
If you don't want to stand, Don't!! If you coose not to clap, Don't!! If you don't want to dance, Don't.
Paul, your song brought tears to our eyes. Keep up the good work!!!
GOD BLESS AMERICA!!!
And God bless the music that honors Him
_____________________________
Til by faith I met Him face to face
and I felt the wonder of His Grace
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rGQoTVhfII
Hmmmmmm.............
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/25/2008 9:00:20 PM
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pauljackson
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Joined: 8/4/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Smokymtnsanta
Good post Paul. Thanks.
Thank you Santa.
I look forward to meeting you...maybe in Oct. I am trying to
find a way for Kathy and I to get to the SGMA Induction Ceremony.
I appreciate your encouragement.
To me Gospel Music is fun, BUT it's not JUST fun.
It's a mission. It's clear to me that you understand that.
There's clearly a mission to what you do. I have read your website.
I get it. Appreciate you.
_____________________________
Paul Jackson / The Prophets
www.pauljacksongroup.com
www.pauljacksongroup.com/blog
www.myspace.com/pauljacksonsings
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/25/2008 11:47:45 PM
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pauljackson
Posts: 997
Joined: 8/4/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: G.I.MOM
When presented with the opportunity to pay honor to my friends and family who have defended your rights, and some who have paid the ultimate price, I can't think of a better place than a Southern Gospel Concert. Until now I had never met a person who would choose to complain about this tradition. Patriotic songs have been a part of Southern Gospel for as long as I can remember.
I am very proud of OUR servicemen and women. Above all I will stand for Jesus with pride.
But, honoring and encourageing and uplifting our fathers, mothers, brothers, sister, sons and daughters I am called to do. I will stand out of respect for them defending me!!
Jesus gave His life so we can live forever. The American G.I. so we can live in the USA.
God has been so very good to me. More than I deserve.
If you don't want to stand, Don't!! If you coose not to clap, Don't!! If you don't want to dance, Don't.
Paul, your song brought tears to our eyes. Keep up the good work!!!GOD BLESS AMERICA!!!
And God bless the music that honors Him
And your post...THIS post, brought tears to mine!
Thank you. Debbie. And please, Thank your son for me.
The Prophets honor you and him for your service and sacrifice for our country.
_____________________________
Paul Jackson / The Prophets
www.pauljacksongroup.com
www.pauljacksongroup.com/blog
www.myspace.com/pauljacksonsings
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/27/2008 8:36:35 AM
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pauljackson
Posts: 997
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My choir member serving in Iraq (he is a LTC and is 55 years old...we dedicated our performance of BECAUSE THEY GAVE at GOGR to him)...well anyway, he just emailed me a video of 5 young girls singing the NATIONAL ANTHEM. You might have already received it. He prefaced it by saying:
"I hope you can open this file...because it will make tears roll down your face"
I was just impressed that we have recently been chatting in this thread about patriotic issues...and I get this video from a 55 year old soldier (Army reserve), who had to leave his wife and children (high school son & college daughter) to go to a desert foreign land for 14 months. What an amazing spirit! He is over there, and he's trying to encourage me, back here. This is the kind of American that is sacrificing for us!
He is a PROPHETS Fan...one of the first people to buy our Cd. He's been sharing it with others...other soldiers have ordered our Cd as a result. It is touching their lives. It is spreading the Gospel....AND it is lifting their morale. These soldiers are telling me things like, "thank you for not forgetting us" and "thank you for putting a song for us on your Cd"...now that blesses my heart!
So if you have not received the National Anthem video he sent me, I will be glad to fwd it to you...just PM me your email, if I don't already have it
I am still getting orders almost everyday for THE PROPHETS' new Cd. Even getting repeat orders. It's been a joy meeting all of these SG fans and turning customers into friends. SO...my offer to pay all the postage and shipping costs is still good. IF YOU WANT A CD...email me your mailing address and your phone number and I will mail your copy with an invoice for $15. Will send it as soon as I get your order. Thanks!
LAST THING: I took yesterday off to spend virtually the entire day with my Mother. She turned 80 yesterday. We had a fantastic day and evening. If you would like to read about it, or see a pic of my Mom, Wife and son WITH SG Legend, ED HILL, just go to my blog. The Link is below in my Signature. Mom would be blessed if you would leave her a belated B-Day greeting.
_____________________________
Paul Jackson / The Prophets
www.pauljacksongroup.com
www.pauljacksongroup.com/blog
www.myspace.com/pauljacksonsings
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/27/2008 8:39:40 AM
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Qtman
Posts: 10024
Joined: 3/21/2006
From: Crimson Tide Country
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Paul I had that video and posted a link to it a while back. I believe it is five sisters from Texas. They range in age from I think up to about 10 or 11. They are awesome.
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Remember: God loves you and I'm trying!
~rogasinger4Him
Body Piercings
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/27/2008 8:44:08 AM
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pauljackson
Posts: 997
Joined: 8/4/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Qtman
Paul I had that video and posted a link to it a while back. I believe it is five sisters from Texas. They range in age from I think up to about 10 or 11. They are awesome.
That's the one Sam...those little gals can flat sing!
LTC Forrester said it would bring tears, and it did to me...
_____________________________
Paul Jackson / The Prophets
www.pauljacksongroup.com
www.pauljacksongroup.com/blog
www.myspace.com/pauljacksonsings
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/27/2008 1:02:26 PM
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Qtman
Posts: 10024
Joined: 3/21/2006
From: Crimson Tide Country
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quote:
ORIGINAL: pauljackson
quote:
ORIGINAL: Qtman
Paul I had that video and posted a link to it a while back. I believe it is five sisters from Texas. They range in age from I think up to about 10 or 11. They are awesome.
That's the one Sam...those little gals can flat sing!
LTC Forrester said it would bring tears, and it did to me...
I watch it from time to time and it always puts goose bumps on my arms.
_____________________________
Remember: God loves you and I'm trying!
~rogasinger4Him
Body Piercings
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RE: PROPHETS QUARTET - 8/27/2008 5:15:15 PM
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Qtman
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