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What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 7:13:07 PM
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Cloak
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Recently, I've been listening to a number of preachers who stressed the importance of being baptized by the Holy Spirit...
To me, I am familiar with the usual traditional baptism which is with water, either as a child or adult. When it comes to Baptism by the Holy Spirit, I have no clue.
In addition, they stressed that, this kind of baptism is as critical for a Christian to have as the traditional one.
My questions:
1- What is the Baptism by the Holy Spirit?
2- Do we need to have it? If yes, Why?
3- What are the advantages of this kind of Baptism? In what way will it make us better Christians. If we're unable to get it, will lack of it make us lousy or inadequate Christians?
Thanks in advance to all!
_____________________________
Blessings!
And My God shall meet ALL Your Needs according to His glorious riches in Christ Jesus. (Philippians 4: 19)
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 9:19:04 PM
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gruvEdude
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Many say that speaking in tongues accompanies this baptism (which did not occur with the thief on the cross nor myself.)
When someone accepts Jesus as their Savior, they are immediately baptized by the Holy Spirit.
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From death he did rise and will come again.
Move on with him now to be ready for then.
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 9:52:38 PM
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MrFribbles
Posts: 1884
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quote:
What is the Baptism by the Holy Spirit?
As I understand it, it is the process of indwelling and sealing that occurs at conversion. Ephesians 1:13-14 speaks on this, I believe.
quote:
Do we need to have it? If yes, Why?
Since it is a basic aspect of becoming a Christian, I would say yes, we do.
quote:
What are the advantages of this kind of Baptism? In what way will it make us better Christians. If we're unable to get it, will lack of it make us lousy or inadequate Christians?
The advantage is... We're saved. ; ) I don't think it's some kind of "power-up" for Christians, nor do I think there are any immediately accompanying signs.
_____________________________
You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 10:22:14 PM
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TJO5
Posts: 138
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Cloak
Recently, I've been listening to a number of preachers who stressed the importance of being baptized by the Holy Spirit...
To me, I am familiar with the usual traditional baptism which is with water, either as a child or adult. When it comes to Baptism by the Holy Spirit, I have no clue.
In addition, they stressed that, this kind of baptism is as critical for a Christian to have as the traditional one.
I believe scripture speaks of several different baptisms.
Several doctrines are laid out in Hebrews 6,among which is the doctrine of baptisms.
Hebrews 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, 2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.
Do not be swayed by the scripture that mentions "OneLord,one faith,one baptism,... " ; because that scripture is referencing a certain baptism which all christians share-which you will see below.
quote:
My questions:
1- What is the Baptism by the Holy Spirit?
I don't think this is the baptism you are wondering about.
From what I can see from scripture the baptism by the Holy Spirit is the most essential bap[ism that a Christian must have. This is the baptism by which a believer is baptised by the Holy Spirit into the body of Christ. This baptism does not require water,it only requires belief that Jesus Christ is your Saviour. It is this baptism that was possible to the thief on the cross.
What you are probably referring to is the baptism with the Holy Spirit.
This baptism is performed by Jesus Christ when he fills you with the Holy Spirit and empowers you.
Compare John's baptism with Jesus' in scripture.
Matt. 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and [with] fire:
John = water; Jesus = Holy Spirit.
It is the promise of this baptism that Jesus tells the disciples to await in Jerusalem in Acts 1.
quote:
2- Do we need to have it? If yes, Why?
You do not need it for salvation.It would depend on what type of christian life you intend to lead on whether it is necessary. The disciples were told to wait for it though.
quote:
3- What are the advantages of this kind of Baptism? In what way will it make us better Christians. If we're unable to get it, will lack of it make us lousy or inadequate Christians?
Thanks in advance to all!
It is the natural progression in your christian walk. The bible speaks about it. It will empower you to fulfill your personal ministry. There is no way not to get it if you believe in it, it is yours for the asking ( I would recommend studying the scriptures for yourself to decide if you believe it or not).
Lack of it won't make you a lousy christian at all,just as having it hasn't stopped some from thinking it has put them in an exalted position.
I also believe that this baptism is just a continuation of your christian walk-this is not some second experience-the only reason it is taught that way is because of the number of churches that have other baptismal doctrines.
Hope this helps.
Yours in Christ,
T.J.
< Message edited by TJO5 -- 7/30/2008 11:09:50 PM >
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 10:22:59 PM
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Cloak
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Well I am Glad it does not involve any type of ritual or ceremony.
Thanks for the replies which make perfect sense to me knowing that we simply receive it when we become saved!
_____________________________
Blessings!
And My God shall meet ALL Your Needs according to His glorious riches in Christ Jesus. (Philippians 4: 19)
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 10:25:29 PM
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MrFribbles
Posts: 1884
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From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
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quote:
What you are probably referring to is the baptism with the Holy Spirit.
This baptism is performed by Jesus Christ when he fills you with the Holy Spirit and empowers you.
TJ,
Are you suggesting not every Christian has the Holy Spirit in them? Or perhaps that some Christians have a lesser quantity of the Spirit?
_____________________________
You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 10:29:09 PM
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Cloak
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Thanks TJ for expanding on this subject and using Scriptures.
Now it's all crystal clear!
Blessings!
_____________________________
Blessings!
And My God shall meet ALL Your Needs according to His glorious riches in Christ Jesus. (Philippians 4: 19)
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 10:29:20 PM
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Carico
Posts: 531
Joined: 8/19/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Cloak
Recently, I've been listening to a number of preachers who stressed the importance of being baptized by the Holy Spirit...
To me, I am familiar with the usual traditional baptism which is with water, either as a child or adult. When it comes to Baptism by the Holy Spirit, I have no clue.
In addition, they stressed that, this kind of baptism is as critical for a Christian to have as the traditional one.
My questions:
1- What is the Baptism by the Holy Spirit?
2- Do we need to have it? If yes, Why?
3- What are the advantages of this kind of Baptism? In what way will it make us better Christians. If we're unable to get it, will lack of it make us lousy or inadequate Christians?
Thanks in advance to all!
Yes, as Jesus tells us in John 3:5, we must be born again of the Holy Spirit because "flesh and blood cannot enter the kingdom of heaven." Jesus also uses the term being baptized with the Holy Spirit in addition to being baptized with water in Acts 1:5.
I was baptized as an infant as were most atheists. That is simply a useless ritual that relies on the superstition that someone pouring water on you can make you a Christian. Only receiving the indwelling Holy Spirit gives us a personal knowledge of Christ and union with him as John 14:20 explains.
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 10:32:51 PM
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Carico
Posts: 531
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quote:
ORIGINAL: MrFribbles
quote:
What you are probably referring to is the baptism with the Holy Spirit.
This baptism is performed by Jesus Christ when he fills you with the Holy Spirit and empowers you.
TJ,
Are you suggesting not every Christian has the Holy Spirit in them? Or perhaps that some Christians have a lesser quantity of the Spirit?
Most Christians do not have the indwelling Holy Spirit. I just read an article in the newspaper that said that in a recent survey, a whopping 83% of people in mainline churches do not believe that Jesus is the only way to God. They thus cannot be born again because the indwelling Holy Spirit is the same Spirit with which the bible was written and thus will never disagree with God's word. And that is the reason for most of the disagreements between people who call themselves Christians. Born again Christians always agree with the bible. Non-born again Christians claim to believe the bible but argue with most of the verses.
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 10:40:15 PM
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Diolectic
Posts: 793
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Iowa
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Cloak
Recently, I've been listening to a number of preachers who stressed the importance of being baptized by the Holy Spirit...
To me, I am familiar with the usual traditional baptism which is with water, either as a child or adult. When it comes to Baptism by the Holy Spirit, I have no clue.
In addition, they stressed that, this kind of baptism is as critical for a Christian to have as the traditional one.
My questions:
1- What is the Baptism by the Holy Spirit?
1- What is the Baptism by the Holy Spirit?
1) to dip repeatedly, to immerse, to submerge (of vessels sunk)
2) to cleanse by dipping or submerging, to wash, to make clean with water, to wash one's self, bathe
3) to overwhelm
No.#3 is the best definition.
Baptism by the Holy Spirit is not a one time thing, the Scripturse tell us that we must be continually overwhelmed with HIM, the Holy Spirit.
quote:
2- Do we need to have it? If yes, Why? Yes, for without Him we can do nothing.
quote:
3- What are the advantages of this kind of Baptism? In what way will it make us better Christians? Act 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and you shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.
John 16:13 However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth;
Rom 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helps in our weaknesses. For we do not know what we should pray for as we ought, but the Spirit Himself makes intercession for us* with groanings which cannot be uttered
He will also help you understand His Word.
There is more, but nothing else comes to mind yet.
quote:
If we're unable to get it, will lack of it make us lousy or inadequate Christians? We all are able to get HIM. (not an "it")
All Christians reciev Him at conversion.
Not all Christians come overwhelmed with Him.
If one never recieves eternal life, they will be lousy or inadequate Christians, for they would not realy be one.
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 10:41:42 PM
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Diolectic
Posts: 793
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Iowa
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Carico
Most Christians do not have the indwelling Holy Spirit. They are not Christians, then.
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 10:47:31 PM
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MrFribbles
Posts: 1884
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From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
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quote:
Most Christians do not have the indwelling Holy Spirit.
If someone does not have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, they are not a Christian.
quote:
And that is the reason for most of the disagreements between people who call themselves Christians. Born again Christians always agree with the bible. Non-born again Christians claim to believe the bible but argue with most of the verses.
There's no such thing as a non-born again Christian. It's an impossibility.
The reason there is so much disagreement is because there is considerable room for disagreement on some matters. But I will agree that if someone denies something as essential as Christ being the only way to Christ, they have strayed too far to still be considered an orthodox Christian.
_____________________________
You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 10:55:42 PM
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Giulia
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From: Giulia
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When rivers of Living waters flow from your belly, this is the baptism of the Holy Spirit. That also turns to fire which then purifies you, actually the water and fire is mixed and complementary to each (not like on earth). If you haven't got this you may be going through the motions of being a Christian but haven't got the marks of a true Christian.
_____________________________
Rejected by the world but loved by heaven
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 10:58:10 PM
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MrFribbles
Posts: 1884
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quote:
When rivers of Living waters flow from your belly, this is the baptism of the Holy Spirit. That also turns to fire which then purifies you.
Giulia, I'm a bit confused about what you're getting at. Could you describe this in less metaphorical terms?
_____________________________
You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 11:07:15 PM
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TJO5
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quote:
ORIGINAL: MrFribbles
TJ,
Are you suggesting not every Christian has the Holy Spirit in them? Or perhaps that some Christians have a lesser quantity of the Spirit?
I am not suggesting anything,I am merely pointing out what scripture says about baptisms. I have no idea what measure of the Holy Spirit comes upon a person during the different baptisms.
But in looking at the disciples of Jesus we can see that they received the Holy Spirit in John 20 - I think it would correspond to them being the first believers baptized into the body of Christ-
John 20:21 Then said Jesus to them again, Peace [be] unto you: as [my] Father hath sent me, even so send I you. 22 And when he had said this, he breathed on [them], and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:
-and yet they were told by Jesus later to wait for the baptism of the Holy Ghost,where they would receive power.
There is evidently a distinction between receiving, and being baptized, in the Holy Ghost .
Acts 1:4 And, being assembled together with [them], commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, [saith he], ye have heard of me. 5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.
Acts 2 shows us what happens to those same disciples when they are baptized with the Holy Ghost.
Yours in Christ,
T.J.
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 11:16:06 PM
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MrFribbles
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I disagree, TJ. Nothing in John 20 proves that the apostles received the Holy Spirit at that point. Jesus said He had to leave before the Spirit could come, so how could He have come upon the apostles while Christ was still on earth?
I don't think that God gives us certain amounts of Himself at different times. I believe He is constantly with us, to the full extent of His power in our lives. However, we are, at different times, more and less willing to let Him work though us with that power.
_____________________________
You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 11:37:40 PM
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Giulia
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From: Giulia
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quote:
Giulia, I'm a bit confused about what you're getting at. Could you describe this in less metaphorical terms?
What I was describing wasn't metaphorical but actual. It is an instance when God touches you and rivers of living water come from your belly. This purifying water is a mixture of water and fire. Not something we can do, rather someting which is given us through our willingness to repent and profess His name. This begins the process of purification through which all of our sins are washed and/or burned.
It is a mystery which we proclaim. That is why it is so hard for people to get. Our motivation is changed from acting from anger or anxiety to acting from joy. Our sins are washed and dissolve gradually with the fire which dissolves them and makes us new;like Him.
< Message edited by Giulia -- 7/30/2008 11:44:58 PM >
_____________________________
Rejected by the world but loved by heaven
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 11:43:44 PM
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MrFribbles
Posts: 1884
Joined: 1/29/2007
From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
Status: offline
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quote:
What I was describing wasn't metaphorical but actual. It is an instance when God touches you and rivers of living water come from your belly.
Are you suggesting physical water comes from the Christian's belly?
_____________________________
You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 11:47:25 PM
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Giulia
Posts: 920
Joined: 9/29/2005
From: Giulia
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quote:
Are you suggesting physical water comes from the Christian's belly?
It is more real than physical. It is a spiritual thing which happens. However it is more real than the physical "baptism" where one is dunked in the water, because this is where the notion of "dunking" comes from. It is a physical representation of the spiritual.
_____________________________
Rejected by the world but loved by heaven
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/30/2008 11:57:16 PM
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Carico
Posts: 531
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Diolectic
quote:
ORIGINAL: Carico
Most Christians do not have the indwelling Holy Spirit. They are not Christians, then.
Right. But unfortunately, they call themselves Christians.
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/31/2008 12:02:51 AM
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MrFribbles
Posts: 1884
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From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
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Giulia,
quote:
It is more real than physical. It is a spiritual thing which happens.
So in what manner does this water come spilling out? What practical ways does it manifest itself in the Christian's life?
Carico,
quote:
Right. But unfortunately, they call themselves Christians.
Very true. Much like LDS.
_____________________________
You're a door without a key,
A field without a fence.
You've made a holy fool of me,
And I've thanked you ever since.
- Aaron Weiss
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/31/2008 9:53:00 AM
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Dan1138
Posts: 236
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From: The Land of Graham
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Rejecting the Holy Spirit is the only sin that won't be forgiven.
Baptism occurs when we are saved by God. We are dead but made alive through the Spirit of Christ.
8"(R)Therefore bear fruit (S)in keeping with repentance;
9and do not suppose that you can say to yourselves, '(T)We have Abraham for our father'; for I say to you that from these stones God is able to raise up children to Abraham.
10"The (U)axe is already laid at the root of the trees; therefore (V)every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
11"As for me, (W)I baptize you [a]with water for repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, and I am not fit to remove His sandals; (X)He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.
Once saved we should not attempt to put out the fire of the Spirit of Christ.
1 Thessalonians 5
Christian Conduct
12But we request of you, brethren, that you (Z)appreciate those (AA)who diligently labor among you, and (AB)have charge over you in the Lord and give you instruction,
13and that you esteem them very highly in love because of their work. (AC)Live in peace with one another.
14We urge you, brethren, admonish (AD)the unruly, encourage (AE)the fainthearted, help (AF)the weak, be (AG)patient with everyone.
...
19(AM)Do not quench the Spirit;
20do not despise (AN)prophetic [c]utterances.
...
_____________________________
My Christian walk is like a car ride. "How long Lord. OK I'll be patient......How long Lord!"
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/31/2008 10:51:17 AM
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JimboFletch
Posts: 6429
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Dan1138
Rejecting the Holy Spirit is the only sin that won't be forgiven.
That's a nice sentiment and even sounds spiritual, but it is not what Jesus said. It is attributing the works of the Holy Spirit to Satan - not nearly the same thing.
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RE: What does it mean to be Baptized by the Holy Spirit? - 7/31/2008 2:43:18 PM
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Piff.
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Is there a difference between being baptized the Holy Spirit and the occurance between Jesus and his disciples in John 20:22?
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